Project N1 Lunar

[Buck Rogers]

Maybe you could try to render the exhaust as a 3D model, then play with the alpha and maybe animate it. It probably has been tried before ?

This might be the direction future API improvements could be made?

 

[N_Molson]

Not sure how they did it, but the Waterfall mod in KSP is quite convincing. Could be interesting to investigate a bit that way.

 

[Buck Rogers]

Not sure how they did it, but the Waterfall mod in KSP is quite convincing. Could be interesting to investigate a bit that way.

Looks pretty good! And the license would permit adapting the code, though I think it would need a complete rewrite and possibly changes to the Orbiter core?

 

[N_Molson]

Yes it does. The exhaust plumes correctly change shape as the ambient pressure decreases, it is really well done. If we can get something like that it does the job. Now I have no idea how different Orbiter & KSP are regarding 3D rendering things. AFAIK both (at least Orbiter 2024) are based on the venerable D3D9, so the techniques involved should be more or less similar ?

 

[Urwumpe]

Yes it does. The exhaust plumes correctly change shape as the ambient pressure decreases, it is really well done. If we can get something like that it does the job. Now I have no idea how different Orbiter & KSP are regarding 3D rendering things. AFAIK both (at least Orbiter 2024) are based on the venerable D3D9, so the techniques involved should be more or less similar ?

I think most of the effect is just a different shader and better assets. Correct me if I am wrong.

 

[Buck Rogers]

I think most of the effect is just a different shader and better assets

Shaders and assets included in the source.

 

[Buck Rogers]

Have been working a lot on this project but so much to do and many issues, slowly making progress.
And some things are still unclear.
Not sure when (or if at all) the SOZ should be jettisoned, it's used for ullage and attitude and is normally ejected after the last main burn initilisation. The last burn is landing approach! I've read that the LOK does attitude control for the L3 complex which suggests they'd be ejeted at the TLI burn? Better would be to have both active (RCS at both ends!), if the LOK can control the Block D main thrusters then also the SOZ? Same problem with the "Crasher Stage", but here the LK is also rotated 45° so the gear fits in the adapter!

Crasher Stage in Lunar Orbit

 

[Urwumpe]

Since the N-1 was terribly short on performance, I would always pick the soonest time to jettison something, most likely you are right by that.

But in case of the SOZ thrusters and their function for providing a short ullage burn to settle the propellants before the Blok D engine can start, the sanest time would be jettisoning them after the final ignition for descent as soon as the stack becomes suborbital on the moon.

It might be possible to jettison them already after the ignition for the final lunar orbit insertion. In that case, we assume that the thrusters on top of the LK can provide enough acceleration for a long enough time to permit engine start.

Right after TLI burn started shouldn't work, since the LOK can't provide forward acceleration to the stack as long as has the LK behind it. Until the LK is separated from the LOK, only the SOZ thrusters are available for small course corrections.

 

[Buck Rogers]

Right after TLI burn started shouldn't work, since the LOK can't provide forward acceleration to the stack as long as has the LK behind it. Until the LK is separated from the LOK, only the SOZ thrusters are available for small course corrections.

The LOK has a similar RCS setup to the LK, forward (ullage) would work. Keeping them saves fuel and improves maneuverability though.

But in case of the SOZ thrusters and their function for providing a short ullage burn to settle the propellants before the Blok D engine can start, the sanest time would be jettisoning them after the final ignition for descent as soon as the stack becomes suborbital on the moon.

It might be possible to jettison them already after the ignition for the final lunar orbit insertion. In that case, we assume that the thrusters on top of the LK can provide enough acceleration for a long enough time to permit engine start.

For the descent the LK is probably enough but if there's enough fuel (will have to check) might as well use it?

 

[Buck Rogers]

External animations done, now I know why on some variants the bottom ladder base is angled.

"Nail-It" landing thrusters testing.
Tried to emulate the fireworks, Also forgot I had to add a deflecter for the maneki-neko cam arm. They are also angled in some variants...

 

[N_Molson]

Note that these thrusters should also have a 'expanded' exhaust. Again, no pressure in vacuum etc...

 

[Buck Rogers]

Note that these thrusters should also have a 'expanded' exhaust. Again, no pressure in vacuum etc...

Hadn't forgotten, it's very hard to do, I gave it a few goes. I think the best way is to make them very small and save in a very high resolution, but still not ideal, so more optics than realism (maybe when there's better exhaust rendering). Here's the last iteration of the exhausts, main at 20%, backup engines at 100%.

I've gone for IIP-13 as the landing site, not far from Kepler. The margins are, as expected very tight, landing is also a bit tricky. Currently flying without an astronaut but have not successfully landed and reached orbit again.

 

[GLS]

The margins are, as expected very tight, landing is also a bit tricky. Currently flying without an astronaut but have not successfully landed and reached orbit again.

How long are you taking to land on the LK? The Blok-D would do pretty much all of the descent burn, leaving the LK to just slowdown enough not to crash. According to this, it would just fire for 10s during landing. The LK would probably have some prop gage or a timer telling the astronaut to abort the landing and come back up, otherwise he would never leave the Moon.
If the LM landed like an helicopter, the LK would have landed like an helicopter doing an autorotation.

 

[N_Molson]

That's a good sign, it is really be supposed to be the lunar landing on 'very hard mode'!

 

[Buck Rogers]

How long are you taking to land on the LK?

Too Long! There's also the question how low to go, off. perigee = 2-4km or lower! I've been testing a little higher to see what the LK control is like. Also The BlokD fuel is dependant on everything from the TLI burn on!

otherwise he would never leave the Moon.

This is the horrible feeling I got on every test landing so far!

 

[Urwumpe]

Too Long! There's also the question how low to go, off. perigee = 2-4km or lower! I've been testing a little higher to see what the LK control is like. Also The BlokD fuel is dependant on everything from the TLI burn on!

Thats all inclusive for the Russian space program experience. Yes, your fuel really matters.

 

[N_Molson]

There is a game named 'Oxygen not included'. Now we have 'Propellant not included'

 

[N_Molson]

Joke apart, the solution is probably to write an autopilot that really optimize things. It was supposed to be mostly automated anyways.

 

[MarkWatney2015]

Isn't the LK run on hypergolic fuel?

 

[Buck Rogers]

Isn't the LK run on hypergolic fuel?

Yes, N2O4/UDMH

Thats all inclusive for the Russian space program experience. Yes, your fuel really matters.

It's a pretty "interesting" (complicated/difficult) flight plan from beginning to end! Also looking forward to (although further down the line as far as project planning goes) the "skip reentry" on return!