Updates Mars500 Updates

[Notebook]

http://www.esa.int/esaHS/SEMT8Q1YUFF_index_0.html

Two of the candidates, together with four Russian volunteers, will be sealed in an isolation chamber for a total of 105 days starting in October. This is followed by the full isolation period with another two European candidates, which lasts for 520 days starting early in 2009.

N.

 

[Notebook]

Victim, I mean candidate, selection moves on...

http://www.esa.int/esaCP/SEMXIVRTKMF_index_0.html

N.

 

[SiberianTiger]

http://www.esa.int/esaCP/SEMSXE4Z2OF_Life_2.html

[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]5 December 2008

ESA PR 48-2008. March 2009 will see two European participants entering a set of modules at the Institute of Biomedical Problems (IBMP) in Moscow. Together with four Russian participants, they will be sealed inside these isolation chambers for 105 days.

[/FONT][FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]This joint ESA IBMP campaign is a preparatory study leading up to the 520-day isolation study in the form of a full-fledged simulation of a mission to Mars that is due to start end-2009. [/FONT]

The names will be revealed during [FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]a press conference at ESA Headquarters on 11 December.[/FONT]

 

[lennartsmit]

5600 applications for isolation for 105 days.:WTF:

 

[SiberianTiger]

5600 applications for isolation for 105 days.:WTF:

Aside of everything else, this is a job paid for.

 

[lennartsmit]

ok a bit better then jail but looks like it

 

[C3PO]

You guys should try a trip on a fishing boat.

 

[SiberianTiger]

The final group of candidates for the next, 105 days long experiment in Mars-500 programme, have been selected, their names and bios are published at the web site of the Institute for Medical and Biological Problems:

http://www.imbp.ru/webpages/win1251/News.html

The experiment will kick off in the end of March, 2009. Before that, the 10 candidates will be divided into the primary (of 6) and backup (of 4) teams.

There's really too much to translate, so I will just post here the participants' pics, names and very short notes on each. Hopefully, the ESA will update their site with a similar information soon.

Arc'hanmael GAILLARD

Age: 32
Nationality: French
Occupation: Researcher in electronics sciences
Hobbies: Science, Intellectual games, Watching Movies, Squash, Jogging, Judo, Arching.

Cyrille FOURNIER

Age: 40
Nationality: French
Occupation: Air France pilot, flying A-320
Hobbies: Grass hockey, Jogging, Squash, Skiing, Art, Photography, Traveling.

Oliver KNICKEL

Age: 28
Nationality: German
Occupation: Bundeswehr military Engineer
Hobbies: Skiing, Wing Tsun (a Chinese martial art), Running, Foreign languages (knows French, Russian), Traveling.

Cedric MABILOTTE

Age: 34
Nationality: French
Occupation: Doing studies for a Doctor Grade in diplomacy and international relations.
Hobbies: Traveling, Foreign languages, Reading, Cycling, Paragliding, Swimming, Roller skating, Chess.

Oleg ARTEMIEV

Age: 37
Nationality: Russian
Occupation: Test Cosmonaut, Technician
Hobbies: Hiking, Traveling.

Alexey BARANOV

Age: 33
Nationality: Russian
Occupation: Doctor of Medicine.
Hobbies: Soccer.

Sergey RYAZANSKY

Age: 34
Nationality: Russian
Occupation: Cosmonaut, Researcher in Bio-Chemistry.
Hobbies: Hiking, Soccer.

Sergey SPITSA

Age: 26
Nationality: Russian
Occupation: Doctor of Medicine.
Hobbies: Track and Field Athletics, Swimming, Fencing.

Marina TUGUSHEVA

Age: 25
Nationality: Russian
Occupation: Researcher in Biology (Human physiology studies).
Hobbies: Running, Open air Games, watching Movies.

Alexey SHPAKOV

Age: 25
Nationality: Russian
Occupation: Reseracher in Sports Science.
Hobbies: Running.

 

[Usquanigo]

5 Ruskies and 1 German, the Frenchies don't stand a chance. :lol:

Then again..... could be bad for the German too. lol Let's hope they banned Black Cross/Red Star from being brought in. lol

The girl is very cute.

But that (and something someone said above) brings up a point - this is poorly done. You either need to get couples, or, perhaps even better yet, swingers (even swinger couples). 520 days is a hell of a long time, and humans need sex, at a minimum, every bit as much as they need food, water, air, and sleep. Intimacy and romantic contact is a nice bonus, but not quite as important as the raw primal need for physical release (with a member of the preferred gender - studies have shown there are different chemical releases, even in the absence of love, that are both craved and needed, and can't be achieved solo).

With 18 months round trip time, plus 3 or so there, it practically ought to be a multi-generational ship, with out the multiple generations part. (ok, that made more sense in my head lol)

 

[SiberianTiger]

520 days is a hell of a long time

Please read the post above with better care: the test that's about to begin will only last for 105 days. They've already done a 30 and 60 days long tests confirming that the facility is suitable for prolonged tests. And the test that will follow is also not going to be the full span test. So the actual 520 days long simulation is still at a bit distant date.

and humans need sex, at a minimum, every bit as much as they need food, water, air, and sleep.

Tell that to your Army Sergeant. There may be circumstances when people have to live in a close community without a possibility to have natural sex. The possible letting out of the need would be what's allowed or determined by the cultural unwritten regulations... I highly doubt there's something in the participant's contract about how should they have or not have sex. I think it holds just a general prohibition on harassment of any kind.

And, if you are so concerned, I'll tell you that they don't have an observation camera or mike installed in their toilets and bathrooms. I read an article on the previous stage of an experiment.

With 18 months round trip time, plus 3 or so there, it practically ought to be a multi-generational ship, with out the multiple generations part. (ok, that made more sense in my head lol)

I think a freedom of taking a risk to conceive a child in the interplanetary flight conditions might only be granted to the hypothetical future spaceship crews no sooner than test on animals prove that the ships' protection is good enough to prevent lethal or health impacting mutations (and the delivery itself would be safe). Until that, they'll have to use contraceptives or face the consequences.

 

[Moonwalker]

I ask myself about the sense and nonsene of such ground based studies, while we have an international space station in orbit (where astronauts already spend more than 150 days in the real space), also called the "stepping stone" for missions to Mars, which to me seems just like absurd propaganda. Mars500 just is another proof. Even more absurd is the fact that beside the isolation, such simulated missions do not have any aspect of a real space flight, especially if its going to be far beyond LEO. It'll be totally different than just be jailed on ground, within the safe environment of Earth, while being observed by psychologists/clowns. Such experiments would make more sense on the Moon, or aboard the ISS at least. I don't see any stepping stones. I see typical ideas by psychologists. And I see something which I see when I take a look to road traffic departments. They obvioulsy need to spend budget for something, before it gets cut. A mission to Mars is not going to happen within AT LEAST the next 20 to 30 years anyway. The study will become rather dusty somewhere in archives, just like many others too. Societies and technologies will change significantly meanwhile...

And btw, humans don't need sex really. At least it is by far not essential like food, water and sleep. You can live without it for many years. I do live without it since 2003 now, and I'm still alive and healthy

 

[SiberianTiger]

Even more absurd is the fact that beside the isolation, such simulated missions do not have any aspect of a real space flight, especially if its going to be far beyond LEO. It'll be totally different than just be jailed on ground, within the safe environment of Earth, while being observed by psychologists/clowns. Such experiments would make more sense on the Moon, or aboard the ISS at least. I don't see any stepping stones.

To quote the project's homepage:

В результате эксперимента будут получены данные для уточнения концепции медико-биологического обеспечения пилотируемой экспедиции на Марс, а также исходные требования к концепции полета в целом, к составным частям марсианского экспедиционного комплекса и системам обеспечения жизнедеятельности экипажа.

Which means: the experiment will allow to get data for a better understanding of the medical and biological provisions of a manned Mars mission and also provide a material for decision taking on the mission profile, the required composition of a Martian Expeditionary Complex and the crew life support systems.

Nobody is saying that after doing this step we'll be able to get going. It's just a step, allowing to check out things that don't require going to space for checking them.

You can live without it for many years. I do live without it since 2003 now, and I'm still alive and healthy

hmy: EIN ASKET AUFFASSEN! ACHTUNG! :shout:

:LOL!:

 

[Usquanigo]

I think this is more a case study of what happens to humans who's only contact is each other for that period of time. That's something that is important to find out, independent of any actual hard vacuum out the window.

And there is a difference between existing and living. lol Yes, if you speak only of what the body physically requires to not keel over, then food, water, air and to a lesser extent, sleep are it. But really, you have to consider much more than that, part of it is just plain ol' basic crew morale. Cramped quarters, being that close to THOSE people for that length of time with no real way to get away, nor anyone else to really interact with.... things can get tense. It's one of the best forms of stress relief and exercise there is. And for optimum health and morale, yes, it is necessary. It's just a taboo subject because so much of the world is afraid of it.

SiberianTiger, I saw that this is a shorter period, I was talking about the eventual goal, and really about the actual mission itself. Just waxing philosophic really.

As for pregnancies, yes, you are right, it would jeopardize the mission, which is why I said "without the multiple generations part". I just took contraceptives as assumed.

 

[Moonwalker]

I think this is more a case study of what happens to humans who's only contact is each other for that period of time. That's something that is important to find out, independent of any actual hard vacuum out the window.

Astronauts only have contact each other alyready for more than 150 days, and that even in the real environment of space flight.

And it is not only vacuum out the window. It is the whole thing during such a mission, to know and to experience that you are ayway from your safe home. You are in zero g which has a lot of impact to your body. And this changes as you land on Mars but also get back to orbit and on a track back home. The astronauts might behave totally different under certain circumstances, as they do in a safe ground test here on Earth. Also, astronauts are usually rather experienced and not that young as the test persons. From that point of views, the study is almost useless I think.

And there is a difference between existing and living. lol Yes, if you speak only of what the body physically requires to not keel over, then food, water, air and to a lesser extent, sleep are it. But really, you have to consider much more than that, part of it is just plain ol' basic crew morale. Cramped quarters, being that close to THOSE people for that length of time with no real way to get away, nor anyone else to really interact with.... things can get tense. It's one of the best forms of stress relief and exercise there is. And for optimum health and morale, yes, it is necessary. It's just a taboo subject because so much of the world is afraid of it.

I think it is a myth that sex is necessary for optimum health and morale. And I don't think that any astronaut ever had sex aboard the ISS for example (but also not immediately if they return home, since they first have to become "fit" again, which takes some more additional time). A mission to Mars does not mean to have no sex anymore. But you can live without it for a few years without any problem. I do so since 2003, which already exceeded a duration of a Mars mission. And believe me, I'm rather fine and I don't feel any different since then. It is definitely not limiting my life and health. And if this is the case for me already, it also is the case for astronauts more than ever.

I think the best forms for stress relief in space flight is sport or if you do something you really like, but which does not contain social risks. Sex is one of the most riskiest things you can do on a mission to Mars. It contains social risks, even more if you take couples on a way to Mars. And I don't think any serious agency or government would send a kind of swingerclub up there. Space flight is not fun. It's hard work and requires astronauts who have A LOT of discipline and a strong psyche. If they don't have so, you can forget a manned mission to Mars.

 

[SiberianTiger]

But really, you have to consider much more than that, part of it is just plain ol' basic crew morale. Cramped quarters, being that close to THOSE people for that length of time with no real way to get away, nor anyone else to really interact with.... things can get tense. It's one of the best forms of stress relief and exercise there is. And for optimum health and morale, yes, it is necessary. It's just a taboo subject because so much of the world is afraid of it.

Well, you know, there is such thing called rigors of traveling. Traveling to space is subject to having them too, until we've got a nice fleet of interplanetary cruise liners. Just a week ago we remembered the Apollo 8 mission, which was a fine example of what I'm talking about (If you didn't, read some in-depth story about the mission). The current prospects for the Mars ship look like something of the size of the ISS, but it would have to carry much more fuel, supplies, radiation armor and a number of expendables per the same volume (or lesser volume). This way, the trip is going to make the present day's ISS missions look like a leisure boat sailing compared against arctic fishing trawler's work in stormy seas. There will be a serious strain on people, and lack of proper sexual activity will be one of the least significant problems. I believe
that the best recipe against sexual starvation is just doing work. But maybe the doctors have a different idea about this. Maybe this is another reason for doing such a test as the subj.


-----Post Added-----

But you can live without it for a few years without any problem. I do so since 2003, which already exceeded a duration of a Mars mission. And believe me, I'm rather fine and I don't feel any different since then. It is definitely not limiting my life and health. And if this is the case for me already, it also is the case for astronauts more than ever.

Moonwalker, I really don't know who is behind your nickname, and I surely didn't want to dwell too much into your personal affairs, but you've mentioned this first. So I have to say the following: In case you are a lady, it's okay with you. If you are a man older than 50, it also sounds like normal. But otherwise, if you are also never felt "the urge", you would certainly want to see your doctor. Such a long abstinence of sex may get you sick with prostatitis or into a different kind of trouble.

 

[Moonwalker]

What happened to the threat? Some last posts disappeared.

 

[Missioncmdr]

What happened to the threat? Some last posts disappered.

Moved here:

http://orbiter-forum.com/showthread.php?t=6102

 

[Urwumpe]

And, if you are so concerned, I'll tell you that they don't have an observation camera or mike installed in their toilets and bathrooms. I read an article on the previous stage of an experiment.

"It is mine and I can wash it as fast as I want, Sir!" :rofl:

 

[SiberianTiger]

What happened to the threat? Some last posts disappeared.

The threat of turning the Space News forum into a virtual swingers club has gone. :rofl:

 

[SiberianTiger]

105 days long experiment team members finalized

http://science.compulenta.ru/405682/

A final composition of the crew of volunteers who are about to take part in a 105 days long experiment of a Mars mission imitation, has been set.

From the European side (represented by the ESA), the primary crew will be comprised by Oliver Knickel from Germany and French pilot Cyrille Fournier. Two other French, Cedric Mabilotte and Arc'hanmael Gaillard are selected into the backup crew.

From the Russian side, the primary crew will consist of Test Cosmonaut Oleg Artemiev, acting member of the Cosmonaut Corps Sergey Ryazansky, and Sports Science researcher Alexey Shpakov. Doctor Sergey Spitsa and Physiologist Marina Tugusheva who also pretended to take part in the experiment, will enter the backup crew.

Right now, the experiment participants are doing their survival training in vicinity of the Star City. The 105 days long experiment is expected to start off on March 31, 2009. Every crew member will have to perform a number of exterimental tasks that will help to evaluate the effects of isolation on a physiology and psichology of an individ. Soon upon the completion of this experiment, a full length Mars-500 program imitating a flight to Mars will begin.