Can this help with my research project?

[scoobydoo99]

Greetings. I am new to the forum and just discovered Orbiter via YouTube. It looks incredible.

I work for the FAA and am researching advanced concepts for future Air Traffic Control systems (I have been an air traffic controller as well). We are looking at systems for integrating air and space traffic in the future (2025+), when we expect more commercial flights, including suborbital.

I will be doing a laboratory simulation next month using new prototype ATC systems to simulate a Lynx launch and a Dragon 2 recovery (to the continental U.S.), with air traffic controllers managing the air traffic around these operations.

Here are my questions:

1. After I download Orbiter, is there a pre-made scenario for a Dragon reentry? How hard would it be to define the lat/longs of the landing point that I want and have a more or less autonomous scenario? (My plan would be to run it on a monitor in the air traffic control operational area so that the controllers could see the progress of the Dragon if they want to during the simulation)

2. Does the license allow this use? (for pure research purposes)

Thanks for any assistance!

 

[dbeachy1]

to Orbiter-Forum!

Regarding your first question, I don't believe there is a pre-made scenario for the Dragon, but there may be an add-on for it. Regarding your second question, I believe the Orbiter license allows for research presentations like that, but I would send a private message to martins (Orbiter's author) to confirm that. :tiphat:

 

[Kyle]

To answer your first question, no, the Dragon doesn't come with the base Orbiter installation. The CRS Dragon/F9R is available on OrbitHangar.com as an addon.

 

[kamaz]

You have some quite tight deadlines...

[ame="http://www.orbithangar.com/searchid.php?ID=5442"]SpaceX launch vehicles and Dragon[/ame]

There's no ready-made re-entry scenario, however it's quite easy to make one -- either by flying the mission and pressing Ctrl+S at the right point, or by using Scenario Editor (section 20.1 in the Orbiter manual).

The go-to tool for precision landings is [ame="http://orbithangar.com/searchid.php?ID=2139"]AeroBrakeMFD[/ame] . It has a built-in autopilot which maintains AoA. I'm not sure how Dragon lands exactly, but if you can land it using just the AerobrakeMFD autopilot, then just save the scenario after deorbit burn with AeroBrakeMFD autopilot configured and enabled -- and it should just land itself without the user intervention.

If that doesn't work, then Orbiter has a builtin flight recording / replay feature (section 18 in the Orbiter manual) -- land manually, record the flight, and then just replay it.

If you want something to automatically land the Dragon at user-specified coordinates, then it would require writing a custom autopilot, but I believe that there are several people on the forum who could write you one.

No XCOR Lynx at the moment. Fortunately, for your purposes a vehicle based on spaceraft3 / GenericVessel should be enough (these are made by editing the config file) so it's very easy to make (or find someone who can make one). Doubly so if your Lynx does not have to look like the real thing (i.e. you can use some other mesh). Or just fly around in DeltaGlider and pretend it's a Lynx

The really interesting part though is getting data out of Orbiter and into your ATC system. (If I understand correctly, the purpose of the exercise is that the ATC people can see the Dragon/Lynx on their screens.) For that purpose, we have [ame="http://orbithangar.com/searchid.php?ID=6435"]Orb::Connect::Web 3.19[/ame] which gives you all flight data in real time over a TCP socket (or via a HTTP server). We even have a [ame="http://orbithangar.com/searchid.php?ID=6437"]client library for LabView[/ame], and you can have a look at an example client in C#. If you need help in building the interface code, feel free to ask me -- interfacing to Orbiter is something I specialize in.

 

[boogabooga]

Wait, you're not using STK?

 

[scoobydoo99]

You have some quite tight deadlines...

SpaceX launch vehicles and Dragon

There's no ready-made re-entry scenario, however it's quite easy to make one -- either by flying the mission and pressing Ctrl+S at the right point, or by using Scenario Editor (section 20.1 in the Orbiter manual).

The go-to tool for precision landings is AeroBrakeMFD . It has a built-in autopilot which maintains AoA. I'm not sure how Dragon lands exactly, but if you can land it using just the AerobrakeMFD autopilot, then just save the scenario after deorbit burn with AeroBrakeMFD autopilot configured and enabled -- and it should just land itself without the user intervention.

If that doesn't work, then Orbiter has a builtin flight recording / replay feature (section 18 in the Orbiter manual) -- land manually, record the flight, and then just replay it.

If you want something to automatically land the Dragon at user-specified coordinates, then it would require writing a custom autopilot, but I believe that there are several people on the forum who could write you one.

No XCOR Lynx at the moment. Fortunately, for your purposes a vehicle based on spaceraft3 / GenericVessel should be enough (these are made by editing the config file) so it's very easy to make (or find someone who can make one). Doubly so if your Lynx does not have to look like the real thing (i.e. you can use some other mesh). Or just fly around in DeltaGlider and pretend it's a Lynx

The really interesting part though is getting data out of Orbiter and into your ATC system. (If I understand correctly, the purpose of the exercise is that the ATC people can see the Dragon/Lynx on their screens.) For that purpose, we have Orb::Connect::Web 3.19 which gives you all flight data in real time over a TCP socket (or via a HTTP server). We even have a client library for LabView, and you can have a look at an example client in C#. If you need help in building the interface code, feel free to ask me -- interfacing to Orbiter is something I specialize in.

Thanks for the thorough response. Yes, the deadline is tight, and I wish I knew about Orbiter earlier! We definitely don't have time to integrate the orbiter into our ATC systems during the sim, I just want to display it on a separate monitor for Situational Awareness for the controllers. Actually, we have some trajectory data in our air traffic simulator, so we will display the Lynx and Dragon as targets on the ATC scopes. Orbiter would just be a nice background display (today, we sometimes have SpaceFlight Now or NASA feeds up on screens in the control room or situation room). If I can get Dragon working, and get a trajectory with a landing east of Denver International Airport on a descending trajectory, that'll be perfect. I don't want to do the Lynx at this point, since our Lynx scenario will involve a vehicle failure (debris-generating event) and we are testing new ATC software to project debris hazard areas for aircraft to avoid. Our Dragon scenario will be a nominal reentry.

Thanks again! I may have more questions after I get Orbiter installed and take a look at the resources you suggest.

 

[PhantomCruiser]

There is also a flyback version of the Falcon first stage that might be of interest?

[ame="http://www.orbithangar.com/searchid.php?ID=6593"]Falcon9R[/ame]

Sure to be something to watch for once/if SpaceX can make it happen on a regular basis. I have been curious to know how a flyback booster would gum up normal commercial traffic. Even if they can spot land with the desired accuracy, how would it effect ATC?

 

[ADSWNJ]

There is also a flyback version of the Falcon first stage that might be of interest?

Falcon9R

Sure to be something to watch for once/if SpaceX can make it happen on a regular basis. I have been curious to know how a flyback booster would gum up normal commercial traffic. Even if they can spot land with the desired accuracy, how would it effect ATC?

I presume you just need to place an airspace block around the predicted trajectory, as with a rocket launch or a presidential flight, etc. Probably harder in practice, but the principle must be similar.

 

[Donamy]

I would think, it would be the same planning as an RTLS.

 

[scoobydoo99]

There is also a flyback version of the Falcon first stage that might be of interest?

Falcon9R

Sure to be something to watch for once/if SpaceX can make it happen on a regular basis. I have been curious to know how a flyback booster would gum up normal commercial traffic. Even if they can spot land with the desired accuracy, how would it effect ATC?

I presume you just need to place an airspace block around the predicted trajectory, as with a rocket launch or a presidential flight, etc. Probably harder in practice, but the principle must be similar.

Correct. Today we would issue a standard NOTAM and close a large volume of airspace. However, the concepts we are working on are much more dynamic and would use automation to calculate conflicts between the 4D trajectories of the return stage and air traffic. This will allow much smaller volumes of airspace to be closed, and increase efficiency for the ATC system.