[RU] Принимая уроки русского языка во Франции

[N_Molson]

Принимая уроки русского языка во Франции

As I signed up for another couple of years at the university (Antiquity History Master Degree), I wanted to take the russian class for beginners, as I saw it was mentionned amongst the available languages. Not so easy.

When I gave my file to the secretary, she looked surprised "oh but uh... why did you choose russian ?". I didn't answered and she realized it was quite an irrelevant question.

- "But uh do you have the required level in english ?"
- "Yes I have the CLES2 certificate"
- "Oh uh very good... But I'm not sure it is available for your Master"
- "Why that, I saw it was open to all students on the 40-pages information notice that was given with the registration file ?"
- "But I have to check. *5 minutes of computer typing* *looks surprised* Oh, you're right, you can take this class. Well, I guess it's ok."
- "Also I wanted to know when the class begins and where it is located in the university, because I can't find any info on it"
- "uh really I'm not sure... But you should try the 13 building, where all the small tongues are gathered. *laughs* There must be very few students there."

Later in the day I had a meeting with a teacher that had to validate my file :

*rises his eyesbrows* "oh and you make russian... (surprised/curious tone) Interesting, interesting..."

And then I started a recon mission in an attempt to locate the russian departement. Well, there was a "13" building. It was in an awful condition, and it was a complete maze inside (german, japanese, portugese, polish, italian, arabic, english, chinese...) I finally found the "slavic tongues" sub-section. There was nobody there. I found a "RUSSIAN" information panel, maybe 3x2 meters. It was completely empty. :blink:

At this point I was tired and pretty fed up. So I took the car, went back home, and easily found the russian departement website on Internet. Of course, they are now located in the building 31, not 13 ! :facepalm:

So - if the information I've got there is correct - I should get my first class Monday morning.

Пожелайте мне удачи ! :lol:

 

[PeterRoss]

Море удачи и дачу у моря

 

[SiberianTiger]

Yeah, learning small tongue Russian is extremely suspicious! :rofl:

Good luck with your classes! BTW, don't forget that if you still plan a travel this winter, it's the time to begin your arrangements.

 

[N_Molson]

Honestly yeah... I almost felt some kind of "political censorship" (oh my God, he wants to learn Russian, he's a Red !). The 50's - 60's anti-East propaganda is quite tenacious and mentalities take time to evolve.

Sadly my finances are currently a little depressed, so it might be difficult this winter (if only there weren't those 2 trips to Paris or Marseille to get the Visa...) The best strategy at this point is to save a little money each month for that...

But at least with that class I should be able to read signs, ask basic things like directions and understand the answer by the end of the university year. That might help ! Also I already got the student booklet which is modern (2010 or so) and clear.

 

[Scav]

But at least with that class I should be able to read signs, ask basic things like directions.

Где туалет?

 

[N_Molson]

Где туалет?

В подвале.

(thanks Google Translator for now)

 

[PeterRoss]

Не ходи в туалет в подвале - мой тебе совет.

Seems like it's not enough to just learn Russian, it's necessary to learn Russian realities too. It was mentioned in some basement post already that basements in Russia are bad places.

 

[N_Molson]

Well, I had my first class this morning and it was pretty challenging ! We don't have many hours so there is a huge lot of new information to get in 2 hours each week.

And now I understand what SiberianTiger meant in a thread I remember "Cyrillic cursive makes me cry !". Really, that's a little nightmarish ! And the teacher said we would have penalties at the exam if we don't write in cursive cyrillic. Nice ! So I have 3 months to get over this ! :shifty:

The good point is that the teacher did a good website with phonetics, exercises, vocabulary...

And also I was able to write my name without help. That's a start !

Oh and my brain just don't want me to write the "и". I write "N" instead. That one is going to be challenging !

 

[SiberianTiger]

And now I understand what SiberianTiger meant in a thread I remember "Cyrillic cursive makes me cry !". Really, that's a little nightmarish ! And the teacher said we would have penalties at the exam if we don't write in cursive cyrillic. Nice ! So I have 3 months to get over this ! :shifty:

Such way your competition in calligraphy with my 8-years old daughter began! :lol: She has conceded you significantly, but not everything is lost, I trust in your talent! :lol: :lol:

Oh and my brain just don't want me to write the "и". I write "N" instead. That one is going to be challenging !

Beware of other 'mirror' challenges ahead:
LГ PЬ RЯ ЭE

 

[N_Molson]

The little "pikes" you have to put before some letters are pretty infamous. Also the soft consonant thingie is pretty nasty.

The teacher told it from the beginning : "take a special care about those things, because cyrillic cursive can easily become unreadable !"

Oh and as a bonus, as we are non-native speakers, we have to write tonic accents over the right spots to show we know them (because it can completely change the meaning of a word)...

 

[PeterRoss]

The little "pikes" you have to put before some letters are pretty infamous. Also the soft consonant thingie is pretty nasty.

The teacher told it from the beginning : "take a special care about those things, because cyrillic cursive can easily become unreadable !"

I think many native Russians wouldn't pass your cyrillic cursive exam requirements including me :tiphat: and most of our medics. Seriously, there's some problem with Russian medics writing in absolutely unreadable cursive. There's widespread belief that medics write that bad intentionally for common people to be unable to read it.

 

[SiberianTiger]

BTW, N_Molson, did you ever write in handwritten cursive in French or English before?

 

[N_Molson]

Yes, handwritten cursive is the "standard" for all school works and then exams at the university or public functions competitive exams. I take all my class notes in cursive (though I'm a bit slow at it compared to other persons, especially girls that have an incredible ability to write fast and well).

So the rule over there is everything in cursive, regardless of the tongue (it causes no specific problems with english, spanish, german... (except the german "B" that I now master quite well).

The only exceptions are for files we have to do for the end of the semester, that have to be computer typed (Times New Roman 12, 1.5 linespacing, 2.5 cm margins), and of course, the 60-pages Master thesis on ancient history I have to write for the end of the year.

The class were cursive letters are learned is Cours Préparatoire (6 years old). After that, children are expected to be able to write in cursive.

 

[SiberianTiger]

The class were cursive letters are learned is Cours Préparatoire (6 years old). After that, children are expected to be able to write in cursive.

That's incredibly early by our standard. In Russia children begin learning how to write at 7 and are expected to be able to, by 9.

 

[N_Molson]

Yes, but I'm not too much surprised. Russian cursive is in my opinion really a complex thing - and not only because I'm new to it -. I think it requires a higher ability of abstraction than the french cursive. Also the relationship between letters and sounds is very different : russian is a phonetic tongue, french isn't. Writing errors tend to be less critical too, you often can understand what the children meant even if the spelling is horrible. And in russian, the rules with vowels and accentuation are pretty complex too. So writing definitively requires a significant understanding of "what's under the hood" of the tongue.

 

[mc_]

На самом деле, не такой уж и сложный язык. А для общения многим нужно и того меньше :yes:

Btw, as i see, you can already speak (or at least - write) in english and french. Scientists insist each next language is easier to learn. So, i guess, it won't be a problem for you.
Good luck :thumbup:

 

[Scav]

Scientists insist each next language is easier to learn. So, i guess, it won't be a problem for you.
Good luck :thumbup:

Bull.

I've tried for fifteen years to learn Russian on and off, and the rules keep changing. This is AFTER German and Spanish.

 

[N_Molson]

Also, french people begin with a serious penalty at this. We are bad at foreign tongues, that's a fact. Anyway, let's try. Great cyrillic keyboard here : http://www.lexilogos.com/clavier/russkij.htm


Практика

Меня зовут Никола.


Кто это ?

Это Юрий Алексеевич Гагарин космонот н Сергей Па́влович Королев инженер.


Что это ?

Это зонд и Луна.

 

[Marg]

Russian is quite hard language to learn. And like french language it is probably not a good starting point (to be native speaker) - many of the letters in the words are very softly pronounced.
These sounds are fairly different from english or french sounds...So accent can be noticable.

 

[Artlav]

I guess a lack of practice is the problem.
I've been learning French on and off for the last three years, and still don't really comprehend what is being spoken.

It should be easy with daily practice and an unavoidable necessity, but without either a language just won't stick.

Это Юрий Алексеевич Гагарин космонот н Сергей Па́влович Королев инженер.

Either change the word order or put some commas.
Also, cosmonaut is spelled a bit differently.